Listen in as Matt and Joe Talk about the origins of the Podcast, and Joe’s entrance to the hobby.

Introduction: 0:38

What are we up to: 5:50

Joe’s Journey begin: 11:25

Birthday Gift: 17.53

First Build: 27:14

First Flight: 28.47

Joe’s Glider Design: 44:28

Front Yard Flight: 53:06

Joe’s Glider Flight: 56:39

Topic – How to get started: 1:10:43

Workbench / What’s next: 1:16:50

Joe: Old Fogey Plan – FTs Build Video

Matt: Burgess Dunne Flying Wing | Remington Brunelli RB-2 | Foamy MARA – The Flying Mustache | Foamy

Bird of Time | Foamy WindFreak | Spruce Gosling | “Sky Terror” | 1924 Lincoln Sport | Minimoa | Old Fogey

TOPIC Links:

Google Search: “RC Flying club”

“Hobby Stores near me”

Dive In – Get some knowledge under your belt

Plans: www.flitetest.com, Vids: https://www.youtube.com/user/flitetest

www.RCGroups.com

Join us on Discord!

Feedback and questions: AviationRCNoob@gmail.com

Music: http://www.purple-planet.com

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Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/avaitionrcnoob/message

TRANSCRIPT:

Welcome back to the aviation RC News Podcast. You found us. My name is Matt Allen and here’s my accomplished Joe. We’re here to be with you along in your adventure to Racy airborne proficiency. Racy? That’s right. It’s the best way to go. I’m going to give one more go. If it works, it works. Otherwise, use the RC and then we’ll work with it and keep in the razzing after that. Welcome back to the aviation RC News Podcast. You found us. My name is Matt. And I’m Joe. We’re here to be with you along in your adventure to RC airborne proficiency. So buckle in. Let’s take off. All right. So now that we’re here together and the time period is between Christmas of 2019 and New Year’s of 2019. We have had a little bit of time here to kind of do a bunch of stuff on our own. Spend a lot of time with family and friends and get all caught up in the different holidays between November so between Thanksgiving and Christmas and the coming New Year. But we’ve both been busy getting involved in this hobby. I’ve been involved for a couple of years, and Joe just started. That’s part of what this episode is about. It’s about talking to Joe and seeing what his journey has been so far, because the point of this is to help each of you in your journey through the RC hobby, the aviation hobby here, it was a mess. I was hoping to maybe just talking about it and kind of understanding little aspects better and hearing the kinds of stuff that we go through and some of our guests go through. Maybe you can kind of learn something and maybe avoid either avoid the pitfalls or listen to it and go. Well. I didn’t listen. But at least I knew better and kind of know that this happens. I’m not alone, so let me talk about what I’ve been doing. I’m heavily involved with flight test. It was one of my avenues of getting into the RC aviation hobby. They are a YouTube channel as well as a store. And their whole purpose is to use the RC airplane hobby to bring people together. And they wanted to use that and make it affordable so that almost anybody can get back into it. Because what they were noticing is that it seemed like the only people who are flying RC planes and stuff were old Chris Smudgeny guys, I guess kind of like myself, who had money but were just old and there’s no new kids. And when he kind of gets asked a bunch of his friends, why don’t you do this? Isn’t this awesome? Everybody replied, well, of course, but it’s just too expensive and it’s too hard. And so you said, well, you know, I think I can change that because the guy who started it, Josh Pixler, you’ll hear me mention his name just when talking about things, he basically said, man, I’ve been doing this since I was a kid, so I know the pitfalls. I mean, some of it I’ve forgotten, but I remember what it was like. I think I know how way to get people in. So he said, let me use common materials, the stuff you can get, the dollar tree or the walmart, and let me show you how you can take this stuff and get into the air and just have fun. And it’s cheap, so if you blow it and you’re crashing to the ground because you will, it’s okay. It’s only a couple of bucks. It’s a little bit of time, but you learned a lot and you laughed hopefully a lot. And by their example, you see their videos don’t cut out the goof ups that they have, at least not much of them. So you see them try stuff and crash it, fix it, crash it and fix it again and try it one last time. And maybe they get in the air and maybe they only have moderate success, but the whole time they’re having a blast. And that’s kind of the message I took away from them, is that this hobby should be fun. It’s really frustrating. It’s a lot of time and energy and effort and thinking things up and figuring them out and putting them together, and you’re going, come on, baby. But you’re literally launching things into the air. They’re light and fragile, so they’re going to come back to the earth one way or the other. If it’s fast, they’re not going to make it. And that can be pretty frustrating when you spend some time putting it together. So what I’ve been involved with is the flight test community. There’s a bunch of people who really kind of embrace this idea, and what they do is every so often put a challenge out there saying, hey, this year it was go grab a balsaket plan set and see if you can turn it into a foam board plan set. So make your plan out of dollar tree foam board so that people can use the plans that are existing and say that it’s okay, you can make them out of foam board, too. And so I’ve kind of raised my hand and put my hat in the ring for an awful lot of planes. I’m not going to talk about it, except it’s over six, and I think it’s still under a dozen, but not much. About three. I think about three, but there’s about another four that are about 80%. Some of them were done, and I just haven’t thrown them in the air yet. Some of them are really close. I just haven’t rebuilt something that smashed when it landed. And there’s about four or five projects which are really projects I have like really close to done already. I just need about maybe an hour or three to finish up the last couple of steps and see if it works. And most of those are still in that state. So I haven’t even started tackling those, partly because they’ve been there a while and they’re not new and exciting like some of the other projects. Like a Burges done flying wing. It’s a 1914 by wing tail is flyer, so it has no tail. It’s almost like a bomber, the B two bomber, but from 1914, way back when the Wright brothers were still selling airplanes to the military, and these guys created one of the first amphibious things. They brought it to the Canadian military. Long story short, I took this relatively simple plan, made it out of foam board. It seemed like a perfect fit, and I got it flying in the air. A couple of crashes, a couple of tents. It didn’t work so good, but I kept at it, and I found the right way to get it going, and off it went. And so I’ve been kind of flying that as proof of concept success that some of these other ones that are a little bit more challenging, if I just keep at it, I’ll be able to make it. I’ll get them flying too. And in the meantime, I also have some storebought gliders, some other homemade crafts that I know fly really well. So I bring those out on occasion just to kind of get a taste of aviation fun. And then I kind of put them away because I have these other projects that I really want to finish up. So I’ve been working on those for the last forever, but probably about like two to three months. Okay, so just for a moment of clarification, when earlier you said you were heavily involved with flight tests, by that you don’t mean you work with flight tests. You’ve followed their materials, you follow their channel, you’ve been in their forums, you’ve used their power packs. Exactly. I use their kind of methodologies. And all of the information. I mean, they’ve been releasing information for about the past six years. Every one of their designs, they release the plans for free. And I have access to a full size plotter, so that makes it really easy to print them and try them. And they also have a build video for every single one of their builds. So they run through step by step exactly how to build their plane. They also have like, an example video to kind of show you how awesome their plane is that it flies. It flies. Well, they’re having a blast playing around with it like you can too. So between those three, it makes their craft really approachable. No, I don’t work for them. I don’t know them. I’ve met them all about a handful of times at their big festival called Flight Fest. But I really am involved with the forum. So it’s basically all the people who are like me who’ve kind of embraced this idea. We all kind of egg each other on to do interesting projects or even if it’s just taking an existing flight test build or a kit that they sell and building it, we’re all kind of just supporting and encouraging each other towards success. Good. Sorry. That’s probably the longwood version of it. But anyway, I’m hoping that what everybody hears through this is maybe the excitement that I have for the hobby. Excitement I have an enthusiasm I have for the methods that were kind of presented because to me, like, without that, I never would have gotten into this hobby. I mean, straight out, I might have gone to the hobby shop about 100 times and I never would have picked up a plane because I look at the price tag of $400 or $300 and, oh, I need a transmitter for 200 oh, jeez. 90 batteries. Each one of them is 30. Oh, forget this. This is terrible. I can’t do this. I’m not going to put $600 into something I don’t know will work and I don’t know that I’ll enjoy. So these guys said, hey, you got about $100. Give it a go, man. Here’s how. And so I went in from there, and I think I described a little bit earlier about that, but that’s really what sold me, and I’ve consequently spent way more than that $400 towards this hobby. But I’ve had an incredible blast and an incredible learning journey along the way. Now, I know that ever since we got together and I started doing this, you kept looking over at what I was doing because I have a plane out here or a rack of planes by the next year or so. And you’re like, what the heck is going on, man? You really like this stuff. And I’m like, this is awesome. And so I think I invited you the one time you were over to come out with me to the field because you were interested. You said that you had some experience. And so I gave you this little tiny wing called they call it the mini arrow from flight test. Wasn’t an adult, didn’t have the semi vertical stabilizers on it, right? It was just a flying wing, I’m pretty sure. And then we kind of gave it a chuck into the air and I don’t know if the battery shifted or something happened. I think it went okay. And maybe you were kind of startled at how it went and you maybe dumb thumb it. Either way, you didn’t react, I guess, quite in time. And unfortunately, we lost the nut, the hell on the propeller because I was using the wrong direction of stuff. We’ll get into that later. But because I lost the nut, I couldn’t keep the prop solid on the plane, and we had to end for the day. It was like a matter of 5 seconds. You had the plane, and I was like, oh. And the craft was fine after the crash, everything was good, except I couldn’t tighten down the prop on the motor. Because at that time, at that point, you weren’t running the PowerPod build on that, you actually had it. The engine either mounted just inside the wing or just on the outside surface of it. It actually was a power pod, but it was shoved in. That pretty good. So it wasn’t going anywhere. It’s been two years. Yeah, it’s been a while since then. Tried to fly that one. Yeah. Anyway, so you had this tiny taste. You saw me fly the Vegan, that little ducted fan, but I think we’re out of batteries by the time I had a chance to show you, I was ready to give you the controls for that one because that one flies great, too. And then it was just like, oh, shoot, that didn’t work. So I pulled out the wing and we just had a miss happen. These things happen. But I was sad because I was really excited for you to give it a try. Go ahead. It was the first time that you and I had gone out, but you were trying to get whatever model plan you just called it. It had one of those inside motors anyway. It has inside it’s more of a tunnel engine as opposed to outside. I remember we were having a hard time getting that one up into the air. Like you said, it could have been a battery issue. Yeah. And I think that’s what ended up being what was going on for the day, I’m pretty sure. Pardon me. So it’s an electric ducted fan. So basically it’s a regular motor setup with a couple extra blades, and they have a shroud around the blade tips of the prop, basically. And that creates incredible extra efficiency, I guess, as far as airflow is concerned. But it’s not the most efficient actual thrust to energy ratio. But either way, they sound really awesome. And they’re embedded in the plane, so you can make jets, which is what people really like them for, because otherwise you have to put a prop on the outside on the back, and you hear this rare noise and not a cool noise as it goes past. Plus, if I could get into that at some point, hey, I don’t have to worry about busting a prop like I did recently. Right. And it’s funny because that’s all part of the hobby, but if you had no idea and you just went and bought an $8 prop or something, and you just threw your plane in the air hoping it would fly, didn’t fly, crashed in the ground, and the first thing to go, almost always the first thing it’s going to give. And it’s probably for the better because they’re usually the cheaper component is your propeller will crack or break or whatever, or bend and you’re sunk. And you’re like, what the heck? That’s $8 you’re just flushing on the toilet. That sucks. This hobby is the worst but if you know that that’s part of it, you go and buy some relatively cheap propellers at first. Right. There are ways to protect your props, which we can talk about in the future, prop savers and all that. But I think that can be a good conversation for future when you and I can really discuss different methods of protecting the prop. Because I’ve only got a few more in my stuff before I got to be looking at other options. Right. And there are options, which is pretty neat. So, like you said, we’ll get into that later episode. But what I wanted to talk to you about was how in the world did I finally get you to get sucked into this? I say sucked into it, but you went willing. It was a longer than I wanted it to be drawn out process or a more drawn out process. I wanted it to be largely because I met you, because you’re a friend of my wife, met you when we were dating, when she and I were dating, and then we had a friendship since then. As much as this is a relatively inexpensive hobby to get into, there is still a bit of an upfront cost, one that just, until recently, I could not justify putting out the money for there are more important things that need to be taken care of. We had to get ourselves situated and set up. And so in the case of my wife and I, when the time came and you would message me that, hey, Joe, I found this kit on the I think it was flight test forms. You found it through where a guy was basically selling everything he needed to get started. Everything. I have way too many other hobbies. I’m never going to get to this one. If somebody’s interested in getting started, I got everything. Which, to be fair, the guy had gotten into the hobby at least a little bit because there were open parts. I could see there were parts I had been used, some servos had been cracked open and worked on. I think he built one plane and it didn’t work the way he hoped. And he’s like, I don’t have time for this. And so he sold it. But that’s almost getting it brand new. Yeah, largely, I think. I know you had a service that wasn’t working. I think all my stuff has been working so far. I haven’t had everything in the box. Hook it up and test it. I’m kind of testing it and make sure it works as I need it. But anyway, you would message me and say, hey, Joe, there’s this guy selling stuff. It was great steel, really. So I got it. And if you want the kit, I think you said 150 you picked it up for, and it had the was that the right price? It was 110, I think. Okay. It had the energy nine x transmitter multiple receivers. They had three receivers. The battery chargers, the batteries, two batteries, right? It had a motor, a bunch of props, the wheels, it had servos out, but man, they had about ten to twelve servos, which is enough for about three planes. Depending on how you use them, it could be three to four planes. Like the guy had bought into it pretty good. Just so you said, oh, man, that’d be great, I’d love to do that. You may have to sit on that for a minute. And your intent was, either I buy it from you or you have it for your son or you find somebody else. As it turns out, I think Rachel thought that I might have forgotten about it to play DND. And right as we were heading out, I was like, hey, Dave, remember Maps got that kit? We said I could do it, right? We got Swing by the bank and she said, yeah, go ahead. And we got up there and she ran in before me. I was getting stuff out in the car. She was like, whatever you got to do. So you may sound like somebody else got it. But she had bought it for me. And then on my birthday, she gave me the full kit. I had to stay for a whole month. Well, she didn’t realize the transmitter was in the box either. She thought it was just the receiver and all parts. She thought we still had to get a controller, right? Otherwise she wouldn’t have done that. She didn’t realize the remote was where the controller was in there. But the interesting thing about Hobbies in general, and then just this situation for me was that was kind of that was a special moment, being able to get into the hobby just between my wife and I because yeah, I’ve been watching you do this for so long. You had tried to let me fly your planes a couple of times. I really did. Technical issues. The nut flew off. You crashed it before I got to fly it. Sorry about that one. I really feel terrible about that one. I’ve been flying one of the soaring craft, one of the gliders that I’d built, and as I’m kind of doing a maneuver, the wing folds and the whole thing just comes to the ground. I’m like, oh yeah, like four or 500ft up in the air. Also, just like just nose down. Oh, no, I don’t think you’re going to be able to fly this one. So you grabbed Tony the Tiger, glided like, let’s get this one. Let me just handle it and get it. Make sure it’s flying right. Okay. Whoa, this is fun. Yes. All of a sudden, there goes the engine. Pull it off for whatever. Yeah. The glue didn’t hold. It ended up melting or shearing off or whatever it was. And the firewall was just flopping around by the wires. Me trying to fly yours you trying to let me fly yours was not a thing that just was going to happen. But I maintain interest because I’ve always loved flight and as we talked about in our intro episode. I’ve done the flight sims. I’ve done the air combat games. I’ve done space Flight sims. So I’ve even taken assessment. I think a sandpiper up actually the actual assessment. Something like a sandpaper. Got a chance to fly those around once or twice. So I’ve had some flight time and I’ve wanted to get into it. So when I was able to, it was fun, I was really grateful and yeah, basically as soon as I got that kit home unboxing around but work was in the way. So it was about a week or so before I really crack it open, get into building my first plane. Right. As a little help for you, I printed out a couple kits. So one of the simple kits, simple to put together. I think it’s like basically plank plane, it’s a motor high alpha motor with a delta setup and then I think I try to give you a glider plane but for some reason that didn’t print out right that day. It was a hot mess anyway. And then I think I gave you a discus launch glider and then something else and so you have like three plants to take home and you kind of oh, I think it was an Ft, an old fogey, which is basically like a mid wing easy gliding under cambered, not a high wing under cambered, gentle flyer. I figured as a starter plane because I had no idea exactly how confident you were with Sims at the time you said you’d simply lot and I had no idea. Right. So I give you these plans, they’re set up for beginners as best I could and I mean, there’s no way to know until somebody, especially with our track record of me trying to fly your plane, putting it in a dirt just a few seconds after grabbing the Rolls. I know that’s one of those things that can happen to anybody. Getting it off the ground is the hardest part. Once it’s in the air and up a little bit, you’re like, OK, we’re all good now. Yeah, and I’m still in that boat. What few flights I’ve been able to do. I don’t have a huge open place I’ve located yet to fly, so I’m just kind of having to keep the craft close to me and I’m not getting up in the air because I don’t want to get it way up in the air and lose control of it or lose direction. Like which way am I flying? They go off somewhere. I’m kind of keeping it lower to the ground, 40, 50ft, which is its own struggle because that’s so hard. Right, so I started with your plans, I looked through them and the old fogey looked like when I was like oh, man, that would be fun to put together and fly, because, again, I’ve flown Cessna and they are stable craft. But looking at the parts list and what it was like, man, I really want to kind of crank one out quick so I can largely I want to crank out a plane quick so I can tackle my own design. I didn’t know that at all. Yeah, you didn’t. Come on, Joe. You didn’t start with the old phone. I’m going with the delta there, bro. Yeah. Do you remember why I suggested the old fogy? I think you’re really leaning on it a the landing gear, the over camber, the high wing, because it would just auto stabilize itself. It was just going to be a good beginner plan. It would. And the other half is I had one, and I was interested in building it with you so that maybe we could meet up on, like, this break and kind of fly them together in the formation or some nonsense. Right. That was my secret ulterior motive there. My trigger happy self said, no, I’m going to do the Ft delta. You build that pretty quick, too. Yeah. The delta was not a hard build. Honestly, I spent probably more time than was necessary trying to figure out how I was actually going to cut the parts out, because I’ve done some leather working, and with leather working, I take a ballpoint stylus and trace the design onto the leather, then do what I want to do from there. The problem is, with the leather working, I’ve done. I’ve not needed perfectly straight edges, and I can kind of get away with that. But with this, the tolerances, they’re not super tight, but they got to be there. Yeah, they have to be. Even in the straighter, the better on some of the pieces. Right. And that’s what you said. Just tape it. Tape it to the board and cut it out. I don’t want to do that. But I ended up doing it and figured out a way that I could tape it to the paper and not destroy the template in one use. So got the delta cut out and glued up and put together in time to take up to fly with you. That weekend we did D and d. Right. By Sunday. I think Saturday was okay. By Sunday. What had happened? Well, Saturday how was the weather on Sunday? It was windy. I was thinking Saturday it was still windy, but it wasn’t so bad. I know it was too windy when we went out Sunday and we said, screw it, we’re flying, and yours got in the air. You managed to fight the wind a good bit. I got mine into the air a couple of times, but I just wasn’t fully committing to the throttling up and getting going. And just because it was also gusty, there was a steady wind, but they don’t catch turn your plane a funny way. And if you’re not ready for it, which you’re new to this whole hobby, not that you’re new to controlling an airplane, but you’re new to how this whole thing works. And yes, a quick adjustment will put you down in the dirt real quick. Right, I guess I can talk about now, I don’t know your full feelings on it, but within my turn, the controller, I was able to go in and actually set reduced controls. And so for that day, I actually had the control set up on a reduced sensitivity. I dialed it back. Go ahead. I was going to ask you when you’re done telling us a little bit about it, go in a little bit more detail. If you’re a beginner, what did you do and why did you do it? So go ahead. Well. So with the turnegy. There are switches all over the place. But of those I was able to program a couple. Which I had to look up how to do it. But I was able to program a couple to basically put restrictions on how much throttle or how I won’t say throttle. Well. Maybe how much deflection elevator. How much throw the various control services had and I was able to dial them back to and had them set in the mode. That when all switches are in the correct position, which I found out the hard way that you don’t have to switch to the right spot, your boot up there say switch error, which will throw into it. But once my controller turns on, it connects, all my controls are automatically reduced down so that I can throw it, I can get up near, I can get a feel for the plane. It’s kind of like my learning mode. And once I feel a little more comfortable, which I’ve not had the opportunity to switch out of these modes yet, but when I do feel more comfortable with the plane, I’ll be able to throw two switches, one for Aileron and one for elevator control, which this is running elevators. Elevators. That’s not right. What’s that? What’s the term of the flapper rounds? Flaparounds, which is basically where you can give them flap like tendencies. So they’ll give additional lift and slow the plane down, but they can still tilt opposite each other to give you roll control. So, with those set up, I was still able to do the reduced control. So once I’m up in the air and I’m comfortable with the plane and I’ve got the feel for it, I can throw two switches and my controls open on up. The sticks still have the same distance that they can travel. Just by throwing the switch, the sticks become more sensitive on the control surface and I get the full range of motion. I think because you’re doing the delta, that’s the mix where it’s elevator and Aile run together, because it only has two surfaces at the back of. The plane. So you can use them like elevators to basically control your pitch and then you can control your yaw by alternating them. Instead of working together, they work opposite each other and then they create role. And so you kind of mix the two together based on what your so the stick controls are either a Leon or elevator. And of course you can go in diagonals and kind of mix that on the stick. And so what that does is it automatically translates that to movement with the servos for each of those type of controls doing what you want with the plane, but it does it with the controls and the computer in the transmitter. It mixes them for you is what that’s a long way around saying. It mixes the two control types to give you what you want from the plane. Yeah. Basically the two servos operate together on both roll and pitch. They’re joined together. I wouldn’t even say they’re slave. They’re just joined together and they mix together. I won’t even say that the receiver does that work. The transmitter controls all that the function as far as which one is going to be doing which. And I imagine every transmitter has its own set up process for that, but just within the menus. Yeah. And the key there is to make sure that you’ve got it set up properly before you ever lift off. You don’t want to give it up when you’re trying to take off and you didn’t set your mode right and all of a sudden you’re trying to nose up and it goes straight down into the dirt. By the way, that’s exactly how my first flight went. You on my first flight, right? So my first flight, the elevators were backwards. So when I pulled back to have the nose pitch up, it did the opposite, so it turned it into the dirt. So when it’s starting to go down, I’m pulling back, trying to get the nose back up only to have it go down into the dirt even more. It quickly went downhill from there, but anyway oh, that’s part of the learning process you and I went through. And you’d already checked at home, but we did a final check and you should do it every time you start to fly. I do it with every one of my planes and I can’t say I get it right every time, but I almost do now is flying test calls it a high five method where you’re basically whatever surface you want. When you move the stick to that direction, that surface should come up and kind of like highfiving each other. So you go over to the left. The left Aloon should come up when you aileron to the right, the right Alex would come up and you should basically be high five an elevator. You pull back towards the elevator and that elevator should come up to give you a high five right. So they call a high five method because it’s easy to remember the rudder should follow the direction you’re going. But would you want to check all that? Especially when you’re mixing the elevator and aileron? Because I’ve had a couple of times where I had a good where the elevator worked exactly like I said, but the ailerons were opposite, so if I rolled to the left, it would actually roll to the right, which would be catastrophic if I didn’t catch it on the ground. Right. And all that is certainly worthwhile checking while sitting on your bench. Still, just make sure your prop is off. Just please, every time, as much as the pain that might be, take the prop off. If you’re going to hook up your system on the table. I think I stressed you doing that because I did my system multiple times with the prop attached, and I said, oh, I want to see how strong this motor is holding up the PowerPod in my hand. Yeah, full throttle. Let’s see what it’s got. Wow. I know. And all it takes is for it to slip out of your hand. No. Or cutting your wrist as the propeller is spinning. And I had something where it ripped up, something I was wearing, and I’m like, oh, thank God it did. That not my skin. There’s people who ripped up the back of their hands, or there’s a number of people accidents happen, and especially with quadcopters, I got four of them going around. I had a thing going. I was built a sea duct, which is basically a big it’s from Ducktails. It’s a big conair. I think it’s L 37 or something like that. I’ve missed the number, but it’s basically a big C plain. It’s got two motors in the front. And so what you want to do is see if you can use the differential propeller speed to create a yawning action, which is what a rudder does. So basically use the props to do all that. Well, I know when I started it, I plugged it in and it started to go, and then it started coming right at me. So I grabbed a brick and went, oh, God, why did I have propellers on? But fortunately, knock on wood, haven’t cut myself yet with that. But there’s been a number of people who have. And the bigger the motor system, the more powerful the motor system, the more dangerous it can be. So as a safety precaution, if you check in motor direction, just take the things off? Yeah, take the motor off. Necessarily just take off. Yeah, just undo the prop nut and take the prop off. Test your motor. You can put a little piece of tape on the shaft, and you can basically feel what direction that’s hitting from, and then you’ll know what direction that’s spinning. Okay, so you checked the plane, you gave it a go. What was your experience? How did it go? We checked the balance, right? We checked the balance before we went where there’s like two little dots or holes on the bottom. If you rest on your fingers, the nose of the plane should be slightly downward, so slightly angled towards the prop when you put your fingers on those dots. Right. That’s the proper balance for almost any plane. I think we found that mine was two nose heavy, which worked out okay for that day. Especially that day. Yeah, that day was just rough. I still had fun. The gusts were rough. I watched you fly yours for a while until I was confident and ready to launch mine myself. And I got a couple of little flights. What was weird was when the wind was blowing stronger and we did a take off, and I had it at, say, two thirds throttle, and the thing was just kind of slowly making his way away from us. Right. It was like an eagle who is standing at the ridge or flying at the ridge and going nowhere. Right. And of course, that’s the distinction between ground speed and air speed. And got a little flying with a couple emergency touchdowns just to keep the wind from taped it up and then got going that final time, and something happened. It must have been a gust of gus, and it just says it right on the ground like somebody slapped it. So I think a gust caught it right as I was starting a nose down just to kind of out again, and that gus just grabbed it. And even though I cut the throttle with the gust cutting across, but it was recoverable. It was salvageable. The firewall popped off, the PowerPod popped out. I think the zip tie I had somewhere in the build pop, it was all recovered. Yeah, we were going to tell you needed to glue back on. You had to just glue the firewall back on and use fiber tape to attach it so it wouldn’t come off the next time. So you learned a couple of things about how to strengthen your build, but because the firewall came off, I think you still have it. Did you lose your prop? I think you still had the prop because of that. I think the glue gave before the prop went. I can’t remember if we I don’t think I broke the prop. No, I didn’t break the prop that time. I broke the prop here locally when I was flying, because I remember you saying to me, you’re like, I wish I had just a little bit more time. We could run back to your house, glue the pod back on, and come back out here, all the props. And kudos to my wife because she’s very patient. That was supposed to be a, hey, we’re going to go after lunch on Sunday after D and D. Let’s just go grab the stuff, go flying. We’ll be gone an hour yeah, it won’t be much later. So where are you at all? All right, let’s go. Because I did you should go back out. Oh man. I just put a little hot glue on this. We’ll get it back over the air. And that’s part of the addiction. The nice thing about is all cheap enough. Once you get the core parts, if something pops, something breaks. You bend the wing, you crack the foam, you break a prop. Which always carry an extra prop. Yeah, I always forget that too. It’s an extra prop nut. Right. So yeah, I ended up building Nifty Delta and then got home. Before we get too much further, I do want to ask you about that. So after you came back to the car, how are you feeling about the whole thing? Excited, very happy. I know you were kind of disappointed in some ways that you were hesitant because Gusty day didn’t get a whole lot of flight time. I think I had a total of ten airtime with that build, right? Probably. But I finally got a chance to fly because I didn’t fly it before I came up. I just didn’t have time with the work schedule. It was kind of last minute getting that thing built and finished anyway. I was excited. I was obviously wanting to fly more. Just time wouldn’t allow that day. It’s solidified that I wanted to keep doing it. Right. You get in the air for two or 3 seconds, those two or 3 seconds are just super exciting. And then two or 3 seconds where you were in control of it until you weren’t, until the wind told you nope. And that’s really if it hadn’t been windy and gusty, we would have had a blast for a good half hour flowing together. Well, cool. So you went back home while you were there too. What were you doing when you came up that weekend? The night before we had our fun with DND, you went and did something and I was like, what are you doing? What was that? You’re talking about building? Yeah. Something else? Yeah, started on a glider. You did more than started on a glider? Yeah, I was going to try to have that ready to come up and just couldn’t manage it. That’s what was last minute, trying to get ready. That’s right, yeah. You have the Delta ready like a week before that. This is about a week before Thanksgiving, by the way. That’s right. I think. Did you have the wing finished or you are close to no, the wing wasn’t finished. I had one side of the wing, one side of the airfoil done. Basically I was trying to build a glider of my own design. You would give me glider plans, but the plan that didn’t print was the Ft glider. I think the ft simplesore. It was the model that was the one that didn’t print. So the one that did come down with the rest of the kit was carbon fiber aeroshaft. It was a different type of build that I didn’t want to tackle. I didn’t have time to go out and grab an arrow from Walmart and cut it down. So I said, I want to make my own glider. I want a big wing glider, I want one that flies just because it’s in the air. Very little throttle input needed and I want to be able to get it up in the air, ride the air currents like I’d seen you do the thermal. Yeah, I remember catching one or two of those before the wingfolded. Yeah, and I wanted to do that and so I started on I spent a couple of nights trying to figure out how to build the actual airfoil itself, to figure out a design from some other gliders plans. But basically the one wing was a full two foot by three foot, I think. Yeah, it was massive. Yeah. Three ft was one side of the wing, right? Yeah, I think it was between five and 6ft long with a wingspan. Did I have the whole thing at that point? I think we worked on it and you’d finished the wing and you were working on how do you make the fuselage so that it will hold the pod. Your pod and be long enough with the tail and the rudder. Like you want it longer than just one sheet of foam and how do you do that and then how do you guarantee it’s going to be big enough and that kind of stuff. So we talked about that and you had basically started on it and you were making really good progress, but you’re like, Dang, I’m never going to get this done. But you have the rudder and the tail on it and I think you had pretty much put it together, but you hadn’t put the electronics in it. Right. You had given me the ideas for how to build the fuselage and then I had to figure out because the back of the wing, the back of the airflow of the top part of the wing came way past the underside of the wing, so I had to figure out how the fuselage mount up underneath of that without the wing being tilted down and causing issues. So, yeah, no, I think when I carried that wing in the house and it was six foot, I was kind of beside myself, I’m not going to lie, it was six foot wiggle. You’re like, Good God, Joe, man, you haven’t even flown yet, what are you doing? You know, honestly, I was going to put a third section on this camber or dihedral? Dihedral. I was going to try for dihedral, possibly polydihedral, and I just figured out that quick. So I set it up with two and had to figure out the cross bracing between the two wings and box and sleeve within another sleeve. I came through your front door, I was like, hey, man, look at my wig. I’m like, oh, man, this guy sold. This is great. I’m so excited for you. Right? And I’m like, oh, no, he built something without he built something without even knowing what the heck he’s doing. Like, oh, no, I don’t want to disappoint him. Start looking it over. And I’m like, no, this will work. The wing is huge. There’s a ton of lifting body, so put four or five layers of foam all sandwiched together as a spar. Normally that kind of gets heavy. I’m like, but that’s not going to be a big deal for this. Really big. It was like one and a half times the cord length in a supersow, which is pretty good cord length. I think that’s somewhere around like seven inches or something like that. And what you had was a good, like ten or eleven inches from the back to the front of the leading edge of the wing. I was like, well, you’re probably more than enough. Like, this looks great. You had a great time. Like we’ve talked about before, I’ve got enough of a background in aviation to be dangerous. And then we flew. And then I’m sitting there flying the simulator. I’m like, hey, man, check this out. Just so you’re not rusty tomorrow, why don’t you fly this thing? And I think it was the Delta in real flight seven and a half or something. So I gave you the controls and then you fly like you been flying these things for 20 years. Yeah, because that’s what you’re like, oh, he’s not blowing smoke about his not having controller in his hand, but he’ll figure it out. Yeah, exactly. You’ll be fine. And I did finally finish that build. Right, so when you went home, I remember getting a text somewhere around Thanksgiving. Yeah, it was about that time because I know when I flew it, I took my sister with me to spend some time with her. She actually recorded the video of the flight for me. But going back for just saying what you’re talking about, with always checking control services and all that, especially if you got a plane that comes apart in two or more pieces. Because for that one, I use servo extenders extension wires to be able to get it all wired up. Servos were about foot and a half to 2ft out from the center of the fuse. So, I mean, most servo leads are about six inches, so you definitely needed some big extenders. Yeah. And so when I got out to the tour, I was going to fly. I had everything else hooked up, ready to go, but I had to plug in because that build actually had Ailing and then the elevators on the back. And I did have the rudder hooked up and wired up that I didn’t end up making use of in the flight, but I had to of course the service back in. But before I took off, before I even wrapped the rubber bands across the wing and got it all secured, I fired up everything and checked to make sure that I had those control services hooked up correctly. I think I actually had the service flipped around so I don’t plug and switch them around. You got to go into your controller and change what Servo is doing. What? It’s quicker just to take the wing back off and disconnect. So yeah, before talking about the major flight of that, the Ft Delta got a couple more flights out of it before I finally sunken in a puddle. Didn’t you say you were flying it in your front yard? Well, yeah, you don’t have that big of a front yard. I mean, it’s not like some people have acres like in as a front yard. Like you are a normal, what, like half acre lot or three quarter acre lot or something? Whole lots. Like three quarter acre front and back. Literally home. If I got home that night, I ran in the hot glue gun, ran out the front yard. Okay, let me just see if it will

Participant #1:
there’s no wind. Why couldn’t it be like this earlier? Yeah, actually the beginning of the day and the end of the day are great for low wind situations. They’re typically really good flying. And in the middle of the day, it’s great for soaring, for gliding, because that’s when you’re going to get the most thermals. Yeah, I just can’t believe it. I think I can fly it here. Oh man. I knew I wasn’t going to fly it like really flying. You wanted to hover it around a little bit. It’s a high off a plane, it’s easy to do. I had to get my kick. I had to get my hit real quick. I just needed to see it go. I know the motor go. I wanted to hear the wind or feel the wind blow across my hand as I tossed it real quick. Anyway, so that flew a couple more times. I actually kept I got it fixed back up and I was carrying around the back of the car. And then one day for lunch break, I went out to the park and flew it. I flew good. That was the day I broke the prop. I took it out another time and ended up nose diving it straight into a puddle. Oh yeah. As it dried, it warped. It warped big time. So the electronic survived, nothing caught, no magic smoke was released, right? No. At least I hadn’t found any problems yet. That’s good. And you probably won’t, honestly, because I don’t think the water got to the se at all. Your plane took the brunt of it. But as you learned quickly that day, dollar tree foam board does not mix well with water, does it? No, absolutely not. And that was the day I picked the prop because I picked up out of the puddle, looked at, I was like, man, that prop looks bit. I kind of throw it up a little bit and the whole place. I got back to the car, took the prop off, sat in the front seat, was looking at the prop man. Anyway, I’m trying to try to flex it back in a position I can take this home. Can I get home? Take the glue gun, kind of put a hot tip against the prop and bend it back. I’m googling. How do you know the answer is no? You know that prop shot? Because I can hook it up to another good build and fired up and that it’s just going to rattle itself out of the air. We got the glider finished up and this is where, as I guess I’ll call you the mentor, as a mentor in this, to me, you have been patient in that you know that you can steer me for some things and some things and you know me well enough. Some things I’m just going to do. Oh, yeah? Which is I got this glider built and by golly, I was in the air whether it was fully ready or not. Now, all the electronics were right, but I could not get the center of gravity right. And I had already mounted the wing. They have mounted the way further forward. I shifted the battery further back trying to get that tailwain up as long as that fuselage was no, I was trying to get you want to get the nose heavier, usually forward. So I shifted a wayne back, shifted the battery as far forward as I could. I couldn’t get rid of all that tailWeight. And I ended up flying it like that. I bounced it on my finger, flip right off, and I said, Screw it. No, it flipped off the back. Huh? Like when you put it on, it fell off the back like the tail. It basically fell towards the tail off your fingers. Yeah, absolutely. It was super tail heavy. If I tried under the poisoned center, gravity would have been the tail would drop, it would have flipped out of my hand heavy. And I did everything I could short of putting rocks in the nose. Oh my God. So typically where most wings have their spar is oftentimes usually where the center of lift is on the wing. And that’s typically where you want the plane to balance because when the plane gets its lift and pulls up that it’s not off from the center because otherwise it’ll start to rotate the plane. So if you have the lift right where the center of gravity is on the plane, when it lifts, it’ll just bring the plane straight up, which is what most planes do. They get more lift, they go straight up. Otherwise they’re going to start turning where the motor will start nosing up every time it gets extra lift. And that means that the center of gravity is too far back or if it’s too far forward, when you get center lift, it’ll start nosing down. And of course, that’s sort of and both of them are if you’re close, you can usually control it a little bit. And the saying goes, you can fly a tail heavy plane once and a nose heavy plane a bunch of times. Yeah, I did it backwards. But nose heavy plane, you’ll fly poorly and fly poorly often. If you fly tail heavy, it’ll fly poorly, but typically only once. And that was about the case because what happens is it gets really touchy to the controls and it’s very hard to keep it in control when it’s tail heavy. Well, that makes sense. And with it being tail heavy is always going to want to pitch up a bit, which puts with it being tail heavy, your wing is angled up, which has the underside of your control surfaces catching that much more force of your airflow, right, which then slows down your plane, which causes it to stall a lot sooner. And that is when it just drops out of the sky. And you had told me that you’d ask me about the progress of the glider because you were like, oh my God, he’s doing this thing. I can’t believe he’s tackling this project. How to you just keep me updated? How’s it going? You should be taking pictures, which I didn’t. You sent me a couple after the fact. I think you had some you’d taken because I kept telling you, like, you need to take pictures and get a video of this because it’s awesome. This is your first attempt at your own plane. Kick butt. And I wanted you to update me so that way I could ask you the right questions so that you would have a really good chance of success on that first flight. Because I was so blown away at what you’re doing. I was excited for you. I wanted you to kick at this. And you obviously already were. You were doing great. So what happened? Well, it’s tail heavy. I took it out to the field and I knew it was tail heavy. I knew there was going to be a problem. But by this point, I have put I probably put 25 hours into that build, which sounds like an exaggeration, but I spent a lot of time sitting there looking at it, thinking kind of some designs on a scrap piece of paper, figured out how I was going to stick these two wings together, how was I going to get this to work. I was actually doing napkin math on surface area of the wing span to know how much did I have enough airfoil spill or wing surface to get enough lifting air. What I didn’t know and I guess could have dealt with is my motor actually going to be powerful enough for this, which you said, it’d be fine, but I got it out there and I said it’s going to be tail heavy. Matt would be not mad, but Matt would be a little frustrated with because I’ve had hail heavy planes that I threw in for the same reason. Because I’ve been building this thing and I can’t get the CG right and it’s frustrating, but it’s close, but I need to see it in the air. And I threw it in the air and it flew for a moment or two. I got excited and it typically failed, ultimately, so I got it here as opposed to a launch start. I actually built landing gear just so I had wheels. So I could take it off smoothly in the grass. Which was its own interest factor. Because it wasn’t sidewalk. It was nice and smooth. But I got it up into the air and. Yes. As soon as they got enough lift. It went lift off. Which it went the nose up. Which I had counteracted that some with trim on the controller. Again, if it’s close, you can shift your elevator so that you can counteract it a bit so that you can kind of fly it. But it’s a hot mess. Usually it was not close. No amount of trim was going to fix that and I knew it, but I had to get it anyway. If I spent two more evenings working on it, CG would have been, right, I want to fly now. It might have been, honestly, only one, because you knew that it was the balance that was the issue. Like, I don’t know how to add more weight. I mean, I’m sure if we had talked, I probably could have said, literally, get two rocks and glue the things in the nose and then move your battery accordingly. And then you would have it. Yeah, in as much as a tail heavy plane does not fly well. It did not fly amazingly. Like, it didn’t handle amazingly. It flew, but it flew. I thought you showed me the video. It flew the first time I took off and I didn’t get video of the first flight, I don’t think. No, this is a video of the second flight, but the first one went pretty well and I managed to get it back on the ground. I did, which, by the way hold on, wait, that was my Golf clap to you. The getting it on the ground was more I got it near the ground and just cut the throttle. I was going to try to dead stick it in and once the throttle was cut, it largely dropped gear absorbed the impact, but popped the zip tie that was holding part of the landing gear on site. I was going to say MacGyver, but I had zip ties in the box I brought with me, so I brought all my supplies with me, but it got it back in the air. Again, it was going to be problematic, but said, screw it on to fly it again, and had the video being recorded that time. And now I got about 45 minutes. 40 minutes? No, four or five minutes. It wasn’t that long. It wasn’t that long. 45 seconds. 45 seconds, okay. Yeah, that sounds about right. I think it was a little bit longer than that. But you had your sister filming it, and she did a really good job of keeping it in frame, really good job, considering she was zoomed in. Yeah, I was impressed. But she recorded, but I got it off the ground and flew. And you’re right, the thing you’re talking about, where Oscillates, where nose is up, you kind of pitch it down and then it stalls, airspeed, it pitches up again. I was getting into that death cycle, and it was fighting it was keeping it largely level, but it would do that a bit, and I’d have to fight the controls to get it. And I flew it over there and I turned it and brought it back, and I turned it and sent it the other way, and I turned it, and at one point it started rolling weird, and I was able to yank it real hard, nose up, and it pulled itself out of it and I rolled it level. And then another point, I think crossbreeds caught the wing and it went to roll it completely over. And I said, you know what, it worked the first time because you’re just in that moment, reactions, trying to keep the thing, and it was upside down, like 50ft in the air. And I pulled back on that stick, trying to get it to nose up, which is nose down, but I was going to try to pull out of it. And you saw the video, it always did half that turn because it just went force, nose first into the ground. You hear it hit, you saw the pieces fly. I’ve seen that, seen many a time from my own creation. So. I knew it. Well, poor Joe. But he had fun, I could tell. I’m like it doesn’t matter. It doesn’t matter at all. He could have destroyed the whole thing, everything, and you would have been like, I’m in which you already were. Here’s the sad part, and I don’t know if you know it yet, you say, yeah, you could repair it. I mean, the fuselage was shot, the wings were gummed up or booted up. So that whole building, I ripped the electronics out, that whole building went in the trash, which is sad because there’s so many hours that went into yeah, but you learned so much from that, and you gained a lot of confidence in your building ability. You learned a lot about how to balance it out of nothing, just kind of like it should be about here. That’s immeasurable. It took me a year to figure that crap out. The nice thing about this hobby looping back to part of the opening conversation is, yeah, sure. I chucked 25 hours of time that I put into it, which is kind of sad. I would have loved to have hung that in here, but it didn’t fly crash. But as many hours as got dumped into it, any hobby is going to have a lot of time. What I lost monetary wise in that plane, $5. Right. It was a large build. Because it was a large build. It was $5. Yeah, it was a big build, but it had a lot of bit. Like each wing was a whole board, but I wasn’t like pulling pieces and three quarter pieces, but no $5. I think I was out for that build. Right. Plus I think that prop might have broke too, but is what it is. So you’re out under $10. You had an amazing experience. It confirmed that, yes, I really enjoy this hobby. I can’t wait to get deeper. And obviously we had an experience. You got to share it with me. By the way, thank you so much. That was awesome. I didn’t expect it. You just kind of mentioned it was mostly done. Like you need to start sharing stuff with me and so you pass it along and that made my day. That was awesome. So I know that was like those are the only two builds I got. I don’t have anything on the back right now just because of holiday time. Oh, yeah. I want to get into it. But we have been going for a while. We probably want to go and start getting into these other topics you wanted to hit real quick before we have to call this episode done. Right? Exactly. So, well, one of the things, the whole point of this is kind of to talk about what does it take to get in? How do you get started in this thing? Right? You got started by talking to me. You saw me getting deeper into this hobby and by deeper we’re talking it starts getting up to my eyeballs. But you see how do you get in? And you saw I used flight test to get in. Other people saw their parents, usually their dad would be building balsa planes in the basement. And so they go to the local hobby store and say, hey, what do I need to get started? So that’s one way to do it. You can always go to your figure out where your local club is because there’s one your RC modeling club. Go to your local hobby store, ask them where it is and they’ll point you in the right direction and they’ll get you hooked up with those guys. And oftentimes most clubs, you go out to their field, check it out, talk to the guy and see if you get a good vibe. There’s probably one in the other direction. If you don’t like the one, you just were at, you know, and almost all of them have like, a beginner’s program where they’ve got a club plane that’s a beginner plane. They’ve got two transmitters that they will have a mentor to help you get into the hobby and really enjoy it. I ended up jumping in kind of like you. I’ll be darned if I wait for anybody to get me into this hobby, I’m going to start on my own, right? And so I tracked down my path before I even had a chance to go out to a club. I eventually found one and talk to the guys and stuff like that. I probably should have went through their mentoring program, but I was a stubborn guy, so I did anyway. You can also go, there’s a club called Rcgroups.com, and it’s literally all those two, the Flighttest.com and Rcgroups.com, they are just chock full of people in this aviation RC hobby. And everybody there is just they love it. They’re excited about it, and they love to share what they’re working on, what they’re doing. If you have any questions, they’ll answer it. Now, with RC groups, I recommend you look online first to see if there’s a simple answer, because if it’s there and you didn’t look, then they’ll call you out on it. Flight test, they’re ready for noobs, their whole thing is designed for that. So almost everybody there will give you a friendly answer. They’ll say, hey, Google told me this was, you know, this is what it is. So they’ll give you the answer and they’ll say, go ahead and look. You might find it there too, but come here and ask, because we’ll be there from the search anyway. So those are some basic places to go. Talk to your friends. Go to a local club. Go to your local hobby store. Ask them questions, how to get started. Look on the Internet. I mean, YouTube videos. There are people all like Joe and I who are posting. Joe doesn’t post his videos yet, but I imagine he might. I might demand it just because I want to see it too. But when I fly something, I’ve got maybe ten people who look at it. It doesn’t matter. But I post what I put online and I share it with the group on flight test and RC groups where it’s appropriate. And those guys look at it and they go, great job, it looks like. And they’ll help you diagnose what we’re wrong with the plan. Because you’re like, Why doesn’t this work for me? I thought I had everything set. They’re like, yeah, see, this is what happens. See, right at minute 105, the battery must have shifted because it was flying well. And then it started getting squarely, looked very tail heavy. When you did that sharp pull, the battery might have loosened. How tight was that? Right? We give you helpful advice, and there are a lot of tools online that you can go to and look up. When you’re doing your designs like you had that, you can calculate the wing area, you can calculate the lift, you can figure out how much your stuff weighs and have an idea as to what kind of performance you’re going to expect out of that or figure out what kind of motor size you need. We’ll get into that some other time. But those are ways you can get started. I got started by looking@flighttest.com looking at their YouTube site, and they have a whole beginner series. And they have probably about three dozen to four dozen planes, ranging from very simple, easy beginner planes. And the Delta is as simple as folding a piece of foam in on itself and putting a couple fins on it. I mean, it’s that simple, right? To something really complex. Like right now, they’re putting together master series where you’re molding foam into cone shapes, linking them all together around a core, and creating a very realistic looking model of famous planes like the P 38 Lightning, the Corsair, which is the famous Gull wing naval plane, the Mustang. And why am I blanking on the other one? It will come to me. It’s the elliptical wing plane that everybody else. If you like the Mustang, you also like the other one. And it’s one of my favorites, but I can’t think of it right now. Go there, figure it out. They’re going to help you. They want you in. So do we. Okay, well, in the process of closing the episode, I’ve already said that I don’t currently have anything on my bench, but I would like to rebuild the Ft Delta. And I’ll probably take a crack at the old fogey next. Matthew, what do you currently have on your bench or plan on working on next? Well, if you said you’re going to start on the old fog, then I’m now putting that on my bench as full as my benches. So I have a plane that I’ve been building that’s something off of our real flight, and it’s called the Sky Terror. And it looks like one of those foam glider planes you get from the hobby store. And it’s got two ducted fans on it. And they have the ducts will tilt down and it’ll be a vertical take off plane. And then they tilt back forward and it shoots off like a rocket. And I’m excited to see if I can get that to work. I imagine it’s going to be amazing flying plane, no matter which way I shake it. So I’m looking forward to that one. I’ve started that one that’s kind of like, separate from the balsa builds, the balsa build. I’ve got the Remington Brunelli Two, which looks like a flying camper. It’s a bi wing. I’ve got the Burgess Done BD Eight, which is basically the Tails flying wing that’s been a success. I’ve got the Mara. The wind freak. Those are planker planes. They’re balsa kits. That I’ve turned into foam board planes. They’re relatively easy to put together, so I’m working on those. I also have a model of the Spruce Goose, the Lincoln. I’m blanking on the full name of it, but that’s an older buy wing that a friend of mine’s grandpa flew with. Churchill? No, not Churchill. Yeah. It’s like Churchill’s brother. And why am I blanking on his name, too? Anyway, I don’t have it on the list, but this brusquece, like I said. And I’ve also got about three or four other ones that I’ve been working on. So I’ve been basically taking these three view plans, turn them into cutout sheet plans like Flight Test has, with all the patterning and the partial cut, full cut. And I’m using an ironing technique to kind of get a more aerodynamic shape, and a minimoa, which is basically a glider plane, about 40 inch wingspan, and then a really tiny version, very tiny, lightweight version using microcontrolls. I call that the skinny MOA cause it’s using a much lighter technique, something very different. Yes, I got all those on my build table. So, suffice to say, you got a lot of open end projects right now. I do. Those are all started most of them were started about two months ago. I was very inspired. Okay, we’ll have to keep everybody updated on those projects as we move forward, but a lot of those are very near their end, so I’m looking forward to hopefully reporting that most of them have given a shot flying in the sky. Well, let’s see how that goes to find out. People had to tune in and keep listening, and they hear progress reports on all that, but I think at this point, when you call this episode to a close thank you, everybody tuning in. Matthew, final words keep flying. Get out there. Give it a try. What’s the worst that could happen? You lose, what, $5? Worth it? Yeah, about. All right, we’ll catch you guys next time. Bye.